Transcript

Tresi Weeks: So the child does not have to have a disability determination in order to create a special needs trust.

Voiceover: You’re listening to the Texas Family Law Insiders podcast, your source for the latest news and trends in family law in the state of Texas. Now, here’s your host attorney Holly Draper.

Holly Draper: Today we’re excited to welcome Tresi Weeks to the Texas Family Law Insiders podcast. Tresi is the founder of the Weeks Law Firm PLLC in Plano, Texas, where she assists clients with estate planning, special needs planning and special needs trusts. Her special needs practice has grown out of her experiences and her desire to help families with loved ones with special needs.

Tresi he serves as the president of the Collin County Bar Association, and is a past president of the board of directors of disability rights Texas. She’s honored to serve our community by serving on the board of directors of several organizations, including the Dallas Estate Planning Council, the estate planning council of North Texas and the Coventry reserve. She also serves on the advisory council of my possibilities in Plano in the communities foundation of Texas. Tresi is a respected authority on special needs trusts and is often called on to give presentations on special needs planning to attorneys, advisors, CPA, educators and parents of children with special needs.

She’s the past president of the estate planning and probate section of the Collin County Bar Association, is a member of the National Academy of elder law attorneys, the probate trust and estate section of Dallas Bar Association and the State Bar college. She’s been named to D Magazine’s best lawyers and voted into Super Lawyers in 2019, 2020, and 2021. And she was voted best attorney by the Plano star courier Readers Choice Awards in 2016 and 2017. Thank you so much for joining us today.

Tresi: Thank you, Holly. It’s a pleasure to be here.

Holly: So why don’t you start by just telling us a little bit about your background.

Tresi: So what our law firm does is we we help families with kids with disabilities plan for their future. And so I’ve been practicing law for a long time, I started out doing estate planning and probate and some guardianship. And then I got involved with the disability community. And I found that special needs trusts and the law relating to these families is very complex and very different. And there weren’t a lot of attorneys that handle this area of the law. And when I got into it, I found out why because it’s very complex, but I still do the estate planning, guardianship and probate. But a large part of my practice is helping the families with kids with disabilities.

Holly: So you’ve really become the go to attorney at least in our area for helping with special needs trusts and for families where somebody has a child with special needs. How did you find your way to that niche?

Tresi: Just getting to know other families with kids with disabilities, you know, I will be talking to parents and I realized that nobody had a plan for their child’s future. They all didn’t want to think about it. What if something happened to to their their children? Who would take care of them? And how would they be taken care of. And as parents, we all have those thoughts. But when it’s a child with disabilities, it’s even more so because they won’t be self supporting, they won’t be able to take care of themselves at some point. So I saw that that was a worry that the parents had in the back of their mind. And so so what I tried to do is alleviate that worry by having a good plan in place, so that that’s not on the back of their mind all of the time.

Holly: What exactly is a special needs trust.

Tresi: So a lot of children or adults with disabilities need certain government benefits programs like Medicaid, SSI, a lot of Medicaid waiver programs in order to survive. And so to be financially eligible for those programs, the child cannot have more than a certain amount of money. And so, assets in a special needs trust, don’t count against that child for eligibility for SSI and Medicaid. And so the trust can be used for the child. But then if the child needs to access some of this government benefits programs, they can get that as well.

Holly: So what types of disabilities do your clients’ children have?

Tresi: So our clients’ children have a wide variety of disabilities. It might be mild autism, or mental illness or addiction to cerebral palsy, down syndrome and then very severe physical disabilities as well. So it’s a very wide range of disabilities. Sometimes it’s a child, someone that didn’t have wasn’t born with a disability that maybe had a traumatic brain injury or something later on. And majority of our clients though it is a disability that the child was born with.

Holly: In order to have a special needs trust, does there needs to be some sort of designation by the government or some sort of authority who’s signing off that this person qualifies to have a special needs trust.

Tresi: So the child does not have to have a disability determination in order to create a special needs trust. When I’m working with a parents, typically, we will create a special needs trust, if that child may need to access government benefits in the future. So if those benefits might be helpful to that child in the future, I want them to keep that option open. Because if we don’t do a special needs trust, and especially if that child inherited money outright, they might lose that option of becoming eligible later on.

So we want to keep that option open. So typically, when I’m working with a family, if they think that child is not going to be self supporting, when they’re older, then we might do a special needs trust for them as well. Often, though, I will draft the trust, with flexibility. So we can operate as a regular trust, if that child doesn’t need government benefits. And then it will operate as a special needs trust, if that child needs to access those benefits, and they can actually go back and forth.

Holly: Oh, that’s interesting, I would have assumed you would have to dissolve the special needs trust if it ended up not being necessary.

Tresi: No, we’re allowed in Texas to draft it with that flexibility.

Holly: Excellent. So as you know, our podcast is geared towards Family Lawyers. So today, we’re going to talk about kind of the intersection of very special needs issues, and family law. So let’s start with child support. What happens with child support if we have a disabled child?

Tresi: So that is such a crucial issue. So for a child to be eligible for SSI and Medicaid, they cannot have more than $2,000 in monthly income. If they’re on SSI, it’s even less. And then they cannot have more than $2,000 in resources or assets. So let’s say we have a child that’s 18 or older. Child Support is considered to be income to that child for SSI and Medicaid eligibility purposes, regardless of whose name is on that check. So for example, so we talked, let’s talk a little bit about the government benefits that the child might be able to be receiving SSI is supplemental security income, this year, that is a check the maximum is $794 a month. That is for food and shelter.

And the Medicaid, the basic medical care, and then there’s Medicaid waiver programs. Those programs can pay for attendant care, supplies, diapers, all kinds of things that those provide. So if that child receives income from child support, that will reduce their SSI. In Texas, as long as the child is receiving at least $1 of SSI, they’ll automatically get Medicaid. So if that child support is more than $794 a month, or more than that child’s check, that child will lose not only SSI, but also Medicaid. So I’ll give you an example. Let’s say that the child was living with the mother and the father was ordered to pay $800 in child support.

Well, that and that that is considered income to the child and this child has the say 18. That’s income to the child for SSI Medicaid purposes. So what that means is that child lost SSI. And because of that they lost Medicaid. And in this case, Medicaid was necessary for the medical care of this child, the child had significant medical needs. And it was absolutely necessary for the child survival. So you know, the child without Medicaid, the child could become very ill or even die. So there’s a way to avoid that, so that it doesn’t count as income. And so the way that we do that is we create a first party special needs trust.

And then I work with the family law attorneys, because that we’re having to satisfy the Social Security Administration rules. And what they require is that that divorce decree or that child support decree, state irrevocably that that support is to be paid into that special needs trust that first party trust. So if the court order orders that irrevocably and it’s got to have the right language, and then we create that trust, then that way the child support does not count against the child for SSI and Medicaid purposes. So in my scenario, then that child could get the SSI of $794 a month, plus the $800 in child support, and then keep Medicaid which was essential for that child’s care. So that way they can get, they can get both.

Holly: So at what stage should Family Lawyers be looking at adding that piece into an order, like how far in advance do we need to have a special needs trust set up, and we need to have the order so that you don’t run into a problem when the child hits 18?

Tresi: So when the child is under 18, the Social Security Administration considers the income and assets of the parents to be deemed to be that of that child. So in many cases, the child is not receiving SSI when they’re under 18. Now, we do have a few cases where they are, let’s say that there’s a single parent who cannot be employed because they’re taking care of that child 24 hours a day. So in some situations, the child might be receiving SSI, when they’re under 18. And so if that’s the case, when the child’s under 18, two thirds of that child support is considered income to the child. So if they’re receiving SSI, under 18, we would do the special needs trust, then, if they’re young children, and they’re not yet receiving SSI, the child support doesn’t have to go into the special needs trust and remind me a little bit, we’ll talk about how that trust is administered.

So usually, we don’t need that support to be ordered into the trust until the child is 18. Because once the child turns 18, the Social Security Administration does not consider the assets and resources of the parents. So that’s when they typically are eligible for SSI. But in many cases, we’ve had clients that go ahead in and let’s say the children, the child is under 18. Sometimes they’ll go ahead when they’re getting divorced, and go ahead and have the decree state that when that child turns 18, this support then is paid into a special needs trust. So they just want to get it taken care of.

Now, they don’t want to have to go back and modify. So it really depends on what the parents want to do. But it’s, you do want that finding of the court that the child is disabled, because as you know, the family law, the family code allows support to be paid beyond the age of 18, if that child is disabled, and not self supporting. So it’s good to have that finding, you might as well get that finding, then if it’s possible to do that. That way, you don’t have to come back later and get that modified. So in some cases, we’ve drafted it so that before the age of 18, the support is distributed in the normal manner. But once that child turns 18, if there’s more than one child, it’s divided out and that child share is paid into the special needs trust.

Now, our clients can’t sign the trust until after that decree is signed by the judge. That’s a Social Security Administration rule. So once that decree is signed, then we sign the trust. But some families find that well, we’re negotiating everything right now, let’s go ahead and take care of it. Now, even though our child is is under 18, they might think it might be a better time to get that on the table. Now, they might have a more difficult time later on when the child is 18.

Holly: So you mentioned, remind me about it, how the trust is administered. So I’m gonna remind you can you can we talk a little bit about how the trusts are administered.

Tresi: So typically, when there’s child support, it goes into the bank account of the parent and they use it as needed. A special needs trust has certain rules, because I can draft a great special needs trust, but if it’s distributed in the wrong way, a distribution could be considered income that the child and could disqualify the child. So it has to be distributed in a certain way. So first of all, we would set up a bank account in the name of this special needs trust, and typically, the parent taking care of the child is the trustee.

So in my scenario earlier, and the child lived with the mother, and so the mother would be the trustee. And so we would have this support paid into that special needs trust bank account, it’s got to be separate from all other bank accounts. But there are limitations on how it can be used. It has to be used only for that child, but it cannot distribute cash, and you cannot have a debit card. So those are the main things I want to tell the parent right away as the trustee, is do not ever distribute cash. Don’t take money from that account and just put it in your personal account to pay your bills. You have to do it in a certain way. Do not get a debit card connected with that account because cash would disqualify the child.

So when I work with a family I I teach the parents how to make distributions without affecting the child’s benefits. Typically there would be a credit card that’s used for that child, and then the trust can pay that off, every month. I have one parent that uses it. The trust can be used for everything the child needs, you know, living expenses, transportation, technologies, school, you know, furniture, bedding, toiletries, haircuts, all of those types of things. And then, of course, therapies and any kind of special needs that they have. So, if the trust is used for food and shelter, it will reduce the child’s SSI by 1/3. But in some cases, that’s okay. And in some cases, that’s worth it to do it, I’ve got one client that the parent uses that to pay the mortgage or half the mortgage, or to pay for transportation, which in this case, the mother transported the child everywhere.

So it was actually used to make the car payments into to pay for gas, car insurance and things like that. So there are ways that that the trust is used to help that parent that the child is living with, we just have to do it in a certain way. So it is more restrictive. And so we don’t want it to have to go into that trust until we absolutely have to. So that’s why we typically don’t do it prior to the age of 18 just because it’s it’s a hassle to do it. Also, if that child is receiving SSI and Medicaid, then once that trust is set up and money goes in it, the parent has 10 days in which to report the trust to the Social Security Administration, and they provide the SSA with a copy of the trust, they’re supposed to review it.

And then every year when they do their annual report with the Social Security Administration, they may have to give an accounting of the trust. And so the parent has to keep good records of what they spend it for so, so it’s it’s a pain, it’s a hassle, but it’s worth it for that child to get SSI and Medicaid.

Holly: So when it comes to child support being paid into the trust, how does the receiving parent use it?

Tresi: So again, you know, we’ve talked about how it can be used, some parents use it, to pay their bills, but they could have a credit card that’s used. Now they can have, they can pay third parties directly. So if they wanted to pay their mortgage, they could just take that money out and pay that car payments could come directly. So any kind of auto withdraws, those types of things can be used. And then for miscellaneous items, I would use, I would have a certain credit card used just for that. Because that way, you’re only having to show records of that one credit card.

Holly: Is the parent who’s administering the trust has to show any accounting to the other parent, for example, in a child support situation, in family law, we see all the time where the person paying child support doesn’t like how the money is being spent, or they don’t, they don’t want to pay child support because they don’t want to pay for the car payment or they want to pay for the mortgage. So is the parent who’s paying child support have any ability to control how that is spent or see an accounting for it?

Tresi: It depends on who drafted the trust. I’ve got one now we’re another attorney drafted the trust. And they did in the trust put that the other parent has a right to receive an accounting. But typically it’s the child the beneficiary that has a right to an accounting. But if the other parent wants to challenge how it’s used, because it’s in a trust, the trustee owes a fiduciary duty to do what’s in the best interest of the child. But we look at how does the Social Security Administration allow it to be used. And so they would have to show that the parent is abusing their or breaching their fiduciary duty.

So using it to provide food and shelter for the child is not an abuse of fiduciary duty. So the only way Yeah, I mean, they may have valid grounds to challenge it, if the parent took that money and used it for somebody else, or gave it away or whatever. But as long as it’s for the benefit of that child, then they don’t have valid grounds to challenge it. The trustee could use it to pay for internet for the home. Or if the child needs a TV or electronics it can be used for that. So we want to try to guard the other parent from having control over it. But it does it is different because the trustee owes a fiduciary duty toward the child.

But the standard for a breach of that fiduciary duty is pretty high. I did have one case where I had to explain to the other attorney that this is what this trust is allowed to do because they’re not familiar with a special needs trust that you can use it for the food and shelter. Typically, I would want the parent to maybe use half of it for the mortgage as opposed to paying the whole, but in some situations, it pays for the whole mortgage because the parent, the caregiver, parent is not working because they’re caring for that child.

Holly: So another important issue that Family Lawyers face, where we see an intersection with special needs, is custody. So what are some important considerations on that end.

Tresi: And it depends on the disability of the child. And sometimes we are going to want to bring in a care manager or someone to do an evaluation that, that for a child with very high medical needs, and we’ve had some situations where they needed a lot of equipment, and, you know, breathing equipment and all types of things in the home, is the other parent willing to have all of that equipment, and it’s so who’s going to pay for it because of Medicaid paid for equipment, they’re not going to pay for it into homes, some children based on their disability need routine. And so they need to consider what would be the effect of the child going to different homes at different times?

How would that affects their disability. So in some situations, the child might need certain medications or supplements or have very restrictive dietary needs, is the other parent willing to comply with that, and that’s often a point of contention, because they’re often not. Sometimes the other parent does not believe in the severity of the disability or denies the disability, and just want to treat their child as normal. And then that can really cause damage to that child, whenever they visit that other parents. So we really have to look at the physical and emotional needs equipment, it’s all of those issues when it comes to custody, determining who the child’s gonna live with, and when.

Holly: So I think that’s interesting that Medicaid will not provide supplies and everything the child needs for two different houses, if that’s the child’s life, and they need to be in two different houses. So that could really be tough for, as family lawyers to alright, not only are we talking primary custody, but we’re talking almost exclusive custody, if the needs are severe enough.

Tresi: I even had one case where the child had very severe needs. And so I think you call it nesting, maybe where one parent came and lived at the home for part of the time and then the other parent came and lived at the home, so that they all had to go to this home just because of a very high level of need of this child. And so when I was involved, that actually worked, I don’t know how many years that would work. But in that case, that’s what they were trying to do. Long term, I’m not sure how that works, if they you know, the parents, married people or whatever, not sure how that would work.

Holly: Are there different types of special needs trusts?

Tresi: There are there are two types. There’s a first party trust and a third party. So a first party trust is created with the disabled individuals own money. So for example, child support is considered that child’s asset for SSA purposes. So that would go into a first party trust. And the biggest thing to remember about a first party trust is that it has a Medicaid payback provision. So whenever that child dies, whatever’s left in that trust, would first go to Medicaid to pay them back for anything they expend on behalf of that child. Now for child support, it doesn’t we’re not worried about that, because that trust is used every single month. So there should never be a large balance. Now a third party trust is created with someone else’s money, it was never the child’s money to begin with.

And so, for example, the parents want to leave assets to this channel, do their will, that would go into a third party trust, or if the parents have life insurance, and that’s going to the child upon their death, that would go to a third party trust. And the great thing about third party trust is that it has no Medicaid payback provision. So whenever that child dies, whatever’s left in that trust would go to whoever they’ve named as the remainder beneficiary that might be other children, or whoever they want.

And so for some families, we have drafted a first party special needs trust for child support. And then we do a third party trust for that parents estate or life insurance. I’ve even had some cases where both parents hired me to do the first party trust and then a third party for each of them so that their life insurance and estate would go into it. Now they of course signed waivers to that joint representation. But in some cases, a parent might be ordered to purchase life insurance for the benefit of that a special needs child, and if so, that has to go to a third party trust.

So we might have to, in life insurance is a great way to fund the future care as that child. If we’ve got a high dollar case, we might bring in a care manager or a financial adviser to project how much it’s going to cost for that child’s care, and try to come up with a good number. Now, in lower dollar cases, we don’t do that, because that’s expensive to do that. But in some cases, we do that is we have experts come in and project that. So it’s, of course a guessing game.

But that’s an option. So they might need a first party trust and a third party trust. And typically, each parent will do their own third party trust, it won’t be a joint because each parent wants to name their own successor trustees, their own remainder beneficiaries. So typically, they have different terms.

Holly: So would you say typically parents each have their own third party trust? Is that only in the case of divorced parents or parents who aren’t together? Do you even see that with parents who are married?

Tresi: Parents who are married, just need the one joint third party special needs trust. And then their estates can flow into that one trust.

Holly: If the parents have created a one joint special needs trust, and subsequently get divorced, is that something that can then be split into two?

Tresi: So they can keep that one if they want. But what I have found is the the trust is going to have successor trustee names so that if the parents die, somebody else is the trustee and then somebody else, what I found is often they if they’re getting divorced, they can’t agree on who that person is, it might be from this parents family, or this parents family. So that’s the point of contention. So if that changes, they might need to separate wounds, and then also the remainder beneficiary who’s going to inherit the trust when that child dies. Now, if, if these parents have other children together, and they all agree on who that goes to, that’s fine.

So I’ve had some cases where they do agree, and everybody’s in agreement. But then in some cases, they’re not. A big part of our practice is doing the estate planning for the parents. And so we do the will for the parents, and then at third party trust, so that will goes in there. And then I assist them with the beneficiary changes of their life insurance, their retirement accounts, and things like that, so that we can name that trust as a beneficiary or a contingent beneficiary.

Holly: So you’ve mentioned a couple times you just use the term care manager, what exactly is a care manager?

Tresi: There are, these are professional companies that typically will have nurses or social workers that will come do an evaluation of the child and determine what the child’s needs are, and then determine how are those needs going to be met? What kind of services does that not child need? What will government benefits pay? What will not government government benefits not pay for? So so they’re useful, especially in the higher dollar cases to do these evaluations, and help us estimate what that care is going to cost. Now, I’ll tell you it in probably a majority of our cases, that clients don’t have the money to invest in that right now. But it might be something down the road that they might do.

Holly: How does life insurance play into special needs planning?

Tresi: When you’re trying to you know, you’ve got child support this ordered for a child with special needs. And then if that other parent dies, that support goes away. So it’s very helpful, I think, to order that parent to have life insurance paid into a third party trust, especially if this is a child with high needs a high level of need. So it’s very crucial. I’ve even had a few cases where instead of paying child support a parent with significant assets, has funded a third party trust, instead of making monthly payments to a first party, they’ll just fund a first party trust with a lump sum.

And then they might buy life insurance, you know, of course, then you’ve got the problem, are they going to pay the premiums and things and so in some cases, if they have significant assets, they might buy a single premium life insurance policy, or a five year premium policy to pay into that. And then permanent life insurance is a lot better for these child, these children as opposed to term. You know, a lot of times term insurance is good, because at some point that will go away because the child will be an adult and they won’t need it. But when we have a child with special needs, the cost of their care is only going to increase. And so permanent life insurance might be a better policy if the child if the parent is insurable.

Holly: So families that are going through divorce, or that are separated, have it hard enough. But when you add a disabled child to the mix, it can really be difficult for families. So how can parties work together to make sure a child has the best life possible?

Tresi: Well, first of all, as part of the team they make, they need to make sure they’ve got a special needs trust attorney, somebody involved in it, who can explain the government benefits. I have found in 100% of the cases I’ve worked on that that parties don’t really understand the government benefits or how that would, child support affects it. So it’s, it’s crucial to have as part of the team, an attorney, or someone that can educate them on that and work with a family, prepare the special needs, trust the language with a decree.

But in all of your cases, that of course, you want the parents to keep the best interests of the child in mind. But when we have a special needs trust, a special needs child, that’s even more critical. And again, it changes the dynamic, because we’re looking at not only getting the child through college, but their lifetime of care. And so working together is even more important. Unfortunately, when it is a special needs child. Having that disability causes additional stress on the spouses. And so in some cases, their relationship is deteriorated even more than it might have otherwise.

So sometimes it’s very difficult to get them to really agree. And again, oftentimes, one of the parents will be saying, no that child’s not really disabled, they don’t really have autism, or whatever. And that’s, that’s a problem. And so as a family law attorney, if you’ve got a client that saying, you know, that child’s not disabled, the other parent is just making it up, that might be a signal to you that that that might not be correct.

So just be aware of that, that if your clients denying the disability, and claiming that the other parent is making too much of it, that they might actually be a disability. And the child may need some more evaluation, typically through the school, if they’re in the school. The school does evaluations to determine special needs. And so getting those school records might be important to help understand the nature of the disability of the child.

Holly: I’ve certainly seen situations where one parent is requesting as part of a divorce proceeding, you know, child support beyond the age of 18, due to disability, and then the parent who is going to be paying child support is saying, you know, no way they’re they’re not going to need that. They’re going to be able to go to college or be able to have a job, all those things. So is it just left up to the family court judge at that point to decide? Yes, there should be ongoing child support? Or does the special need? How does the special needs trust play into that? Or do you wait for a determination from the family court judge?

Tresi: Well, typically we can get the parties to agree to that language in the decree that the child has a permanent disability. If they cannot agree, then you may have to prove that to the judge and get a judge to find the disability. Now, if it’s a minor child, and let’s say they’ve got autism, and you’re really not sure you know what they’re going to be like, then in that case, you may have to wait until they’re 18. And then at that point, go to the court and say, okay, this child’s disabled are not going to be able to work. And they’re not going to be able to work a little bit. They’re not going to be self supporting.

Holly: Oh, that reminds me of a question I did have. So if a child well, an adult now, who has a special needs trust, is able to do some type of work where they are earning an income, does that go into their first party special needs trust? Or does it just go into the regular bank account, and they can spend it as they choose? How does that work?

Tresi: That would be a separate bank account. And they could spend that any way they want. Now, when the child is working, 50% of their earnings count as income for SSI. So let’s say that the child earns $1,000 in wages, $500 of that counts as income against them. And so if they’re getting SSI of $794 a month, they would deduct the $500. And so they would only get $294 a month in SSI, again, which is fine because that they still get Medicaid.

The Medicaid waiver programs for a lot of parents are more valuable because those waiver programs can actually pay a parent to stay home with the child. They can pay for housing attendant care, a lot of things and so it’s really those waiver programs that are the most valuable. So as long as the child’s not earning, you know, way over $1000 a month, they will still meet the definition of disability. If they’re making way over $1000 a month. They will not be considered to be disabled by the Social Security Administration.

Holly: All right, so we’re just about out of time, but one of the questions I like to ask all of my guests on the podcast is what one piece of advice would you give young lawyers?

Tresi: The piece of advice I would give is find an area of practice that you can really learn and become good at. And that you can become passionate about that makes such a difference. It’s not like you don’t have to, like every case are like every client. But focus your energies on finding something that you can really be passionate about, and have a good reason why you’re doing that. That makes all the difference. I know not a lot of attorneys get to love what they do. And I’m very blessed that I do get to love what I do.

And so I think that’s important. And again, not, not that you’re going to find something that every day you’re like, oh, this is great, because there will be challenges and difficulties in any area for long. But also find something that is consistent with your personality. And so when I first got out of law school, I went to Baylor law school, so I became a trial lawyer, because that’s what you do when you come out of Baylor. And it was not a good fit, personality wise. And so when I got into estate planning, it was a much better fit so, so find what goes with your personality and then and then you won’t be as unhappy. I’m extremely happy with what I do. I love what I do. I love helping the families with disabilities.

Holly: That is excellent advice. So where can our listeners learn more about you and your firm?

Tresi: They can go to our website, it’s weekslawfirm.com. w e e k s law firm.com. And also Holly, we have a I have a webinar every month on special needs trusts. I have one on guardianship and one on basic estate planning. So if you ever have clients that want to learn about special needs trusts, they can go to my website and sign up for that. It’s a free webinar every month. And it’s a great way for them to learn the basics of special needs trusts and why they need it. And so if you’ve got a client that’s not sure about what it is and what they need, it is a great way for them to learn about it so they can have some basic familiarity with it.

Holly: Perfect. Well thank you so much for joining us. We learned a lot today about special needs trusts and a lot of information that we can certainly use as Family Lawyers. So thank you.

Tresi: You’re welcome, Holly. Thank you for having me.

Voiceover: That Texas Family Law Insiders podcast is sponsored by the Draper Law firm. We help people navigate divorce and child custody cases and handle family law appellate matters. For more information, visit our website at www.Draperfirm.com